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Living a life of unparalleled collaboration, Paul Williams is surely the only person on Earth able to claim a direct creative pipeline to David Bowie, Barbra Streisand/Kris Kristofferson and Kermit the Frog, all of whom sang his lyrics to the world — including Hunky Dory’s Fill Your Heart, A Star Is Born’s Grammy-winning Evergreen, and the immortal Muppet Movie opening theme, Rainbow Connection.
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Remarkably, it’s just the tip of Williams’ creative iceberg.
His staggeringly diverse accolades stretch back to a different Grammy win with Daft Punk in 2014, singing with a lit cigarette in full Battle for the Planet of the Apes makeup on Johnny Carson in ’73, co-writing We’ve Only Just Begun and Rainy Days and Mondays for The Carpenters — never mind penning the words to The Love Boat theme!
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Insanely, the list goes on, including voicing the beloved Batman Animated Series’ Penguin amid countless guest spots on everything from Babylon 5 to The Hardy Boys, occupying a Hollywood Square in the midst of it all.
To try and zoom in like that helicopter shot into Kermit’s swamp, the 84-year-old legend is here Tuesday at Metro Cinema for NorthwestFEARFest’s closing–night, 50th-anniversary screening of Brian De Palma’s beautifully weird and musically wondrous cult classic Phantom of the Paradise, scored by and indeed starring Williams.
In a long and magnificent conversation I can just barely sample here, the Oscar/Grammy/Golden Globe-winner talks about it all, laughing as he asks to flip from the phone over to Zoom, “I’m so f—ing old, I listened to everything at 11 for 40 years!”
Q I won’t go fanboy on you, but I just watched The Muppet Movie opener and always cry at that first shot.
A At this point in my life it’s amazing to hear that kind of response. What we do for a living, Fish, neither one of us has to give up our fan cards — I gurm out on people all the time.
My last two plane rides, Jamie Lee Curtis was sitting across from me and Meg Ryan was right behind me.
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Q Rainbow Connection is so lyrically expansive for a swamp amphibian to be singing …
A It was orchestrated by Kenny Asher, it’s pretty powerful.
But when you think about it, we wrote ourselves into the worst corner with the first two lines of the song. It’s like we tried to deny any magic in rainbows, you know? But in it there’s this amazing gift that was never planned, where Kermit is no longer the guy at the podium: all of a sudden he’s a member of the audience going, I haven’t figured it out yet, but this is pretty interesting, this amazing, spiritual life we’re having.
Q Can you talk about what it’s like to have a conversation with Kermit the Frog — I know Jim Henson’s there, but you’re looking Kermit in the eyes …
A If Frank (Oz) was holding Piggy and Jim and Kermit and I were talking, there were five of us in the conversation, not three, right?
In some ways, I have a more in-depth, meaningful relationship with Gonzo than with (puppeteer) Dave Goelz. I’m Gonna Go Back There Someday is one of my favourite songs ever, so much inspired by Gonzo.
When I first walked on set of The Muppet Show in England, I never belonged to a gang that had a treehouse, but I see exactly what that felt like when I met Dave and Frank and Jim. This is just, you know, adult behaviour does not seem to be required.
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Q Did you get to keep one of the Muppets they made of you?
A I did! He aged even faster than I did. (Laughs.) I had a house in Hollywood Hills and after a couple years in the window he began to look like Dorian Gray, slowly but surely he got brown and wrinkled and I’ve done the same thing.
Q That leads us into Phantom of the Paradise nicely, but first I want to ask you about first hearing Bowie sing your words on Hunky Dory. That album, man.
A My God. I mean, you go from one euphoria to another. I was an out-of-work actor with no songwriting career whatsoever, a total f—ing hippy writing these new kind of middle-of-the-road songs. I wanted that rock and roll, to be part of that Laurel Canyon crowd. Tiny Tim recorded it as a B-Side to Tiptoe Through the Tulips, and I heard it was the first outside song (Bowie) ever recorded that he didn’t write, but to have that song cut by Bowie …
Years later, in recovery, we both wound up sitting together next to each other in one of those meetings, and that was the first chance I really had to thank him. (Chokes up). As you can tell, it really meant a lot to me. It was acceptance by royalty and I’ll never forget it.
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Q Let’s talk Phantom of the Paradise.
A I want to talk about the Canadian fans! When Brian De Palma and (actor) Bill Finley went to see the movie in New York, I heard there were six people there, including Brian and Bill.
Nobody raved about it, except a few fans in two cities: Winnipeg and Paris. I’m not sure why, but there would always be a couple people who were just fanatics and made everyone they knew watch it.
And this year I introduced it as the closing film to the Cannes Film Festival! And the film stayed alive just because, I can’t even call them fans at this point, because of family and what they did.
And amongst those fans, Guillermo del Toro wants me to write the words for a musical based on Pan’s Labyrinth. And among those fans emerges Daft Punk, and I end up writing two songs and singing one on Random Access Memories, and the next thing you know I’m accepting the Grammy for Album of the Year.
So when you start talking about Phantom of the Paradise, I can’t even muster the language to show you how grateful I am, and it begins in Winnipeg and Paris.
Q We just lost Kris Kristofferson, who was like you a spokesman for sobriety — anything you want to say about that, really.
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A Working with him on A Star Is Born, it was like working with Keats.
But, yeah, you know you’re an alcoholic when you misplaced a decade. Booze made me feel big enough to deal with the rest of the world. Cocaine made me feel like I could shoot basketball for money.
But the career I thought I had had been gone for ten years was gone when I got sober, but I surrendered. Clear vision and clarity are a much better buzz.
People say, ‘Oh poor dear, you can’t drink!’ Of course I can; if I wanted to I could go get shitfaced tonight. But would never do that.
I feel like I’m 34, which I am because I’m 34 years sober … but I’m not that tired.
Phantom of the Paradise with Paul Williams
Where: Metro Cinema (8712 109 St.)
When: 7 p.m. Tuesday
Tickets: $25 at northwestfest.ca
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