CLEVELAND, Ohio — After falling behind 0-2 in the best-of-seven American League Championship Series to the Yankees, Cleveland will hand the ball to Matthew Boyd in Game 3 as the series shifts to Progressive Field.
On their latest podcast, Paul Hoynes and Joe Noga break down what the Guardians need to do in order to climb back into the series and take control against New York.
Listen and read along with an AI-generated transcript of the podcast below.
Read the automated transcript of today’s podcast below. Because it’s a computer-generated transcript, it may contain errors and misspellings.
Joe Noga (00:14): Welcome back to the Cleveland Baseball Talk podcast. I’m Joe Noga, joined by Paul Hoynes, live in the press box at Progressive Field previewing game three of the American League Championship series Between the Guardians and the New York Yankees, Ozi Games one and two. I don’t think it’s overstating things to say that the guardians couldn’t have followed their script any worse way than what they had planned and hoped would happen. Guards ball did not take hold, and the Yankees were able to basically bully them around the ballpark for two games there In New York, it’s going to be different when Cleveland gets back and gets home and gets out there with a full progressive field contingent there to play in front of. But as far as the nightmare scenario in games one and two, that was what it was for Stephen Voting and Company.
Paul Hoynes (01:17): Yeah, two disappointed games, Joe and I think both those games were winnable games at certain points of the game they just didn’t produce. They made errors. The four Wild Pitches by Cantilla were a nightmare, and Bone Nailor didn’t help him a whole lot. In a couple of those instances, they were out. Homer three to two who? The Yankees, big guys, Giancarlo, Stanton, Juan Soto, Aaron Judge, all Homer The Guardians only get one home run from their big guy and the Jose Ramirez. Brian Rocchio adds a home run, but then he drops a popup in Game two that leads to a run. So they just were off kilter. To me, Cobb gets hurt in Game one hurts his back. It’s questionable if he should have been pitching at all. I think. I mean, they knew he was hurt and Bobby still scratching my head over that one. Joe one in a third innings in game two. Obviously he was upset about getting taken out when he did and he sounded like it after the game.
Joe Noga (02:34): And we can talk about what that means for Bobby later on in this series in terms of can he come back for maybe game four or maybe game five on short rest, having only thrown 39 pitches. We will see how that plays out. But I want to go back and just mention and just ask you the question because obviously you were there and you saw, did it look like the Yankees sort of post-season experience and mystique? Aaron Judge was playing in his 50th post-season game on Tuesday night. Brian Rocchi was playing in his seventh. There’s a big difference about what was out there on the field. Did maybe, I don’t want to say that were the lights too bright for the Guardians, but they certainly played like it.
Paul Hoynes (03:17): Yeah, there’s no doubt about that. I think when Cantello came in to Game one Overamped definitely to relieve Cobb, I think. Yeah, I think the Yankee Stadium mystique, the Ghost of New York Pass came in and kind of kicked them in the rear end a little bit there and that contributed to it. And I just think that is a tough place to play, especially in October when it’s sold out, it’s loud and you are in a hostile environment. I think that’s with Will Brennan in Game two in Right Field, really a really good outfielder, I think kind of underrated.
Joe Noga (04:05): Made a hell of a sliding catch in foul territory in the first inning and then,
Paul Hoynes (04:10): Yeah, then he had one ball go off his hand. The Double by Anthony
Joe Noga (04:20): Rizzo.
Paul Hoynes (04:20): Yeah, Anthony Rizzo. That led to a run. Then he dropped another ball. You just don’t see that happening. The fans are right on him. So I don’t know if that played a part in it, but it was like they got thrust into that moment and they weren’t ready for it.
Joe Noga (04:37): And guys like Steven Kwang, guys like Jose Ramirez and Josh Naylor, they were a big part of that 2022 playoff run they’ve played in that stadium, in that environment where they’re the enemy and it’s hostile and we haven’t even gotten really see the Yankee fans get on Josh. No, because he’s not out there doing much of anything at the plate. I think the Naylors combined right now are two for maybe 16, something like that in the series so far, or yeah, so Bone Aler getting pulled out early, getting pinch hit for. We talked to Steven Vo today about how the David Fry injury has impacted his ability to mix and match and switch guys out. You would’ve liked to have seen David Fry at the plate in the fifth inning. I believe it was when Austin Hedges had to take the at bat with two outs in the bases loaded. But Fry can’t play in the field right now because of the injury, so they, they’re limited there. This isn’t about what the guardians don’t have or what the guardians their situation is. It’s more about what they were unable to do and take advantage of and capitalize on the mistakes that the Yankees made and the chances that the Yankees gave them to get back into the game for seven last night with runners in scoring positions, stranding 11 base runners, the Yankees ran into two outs on the bases where those could be momentum changers and game changers really. And they weren’t able to capitalize.
Paul Hoynes (06:21): Yeah, perfect. Yeah, great analysis, Joe. It just seemed like everything they did came up a little short. And Steven Vo has really kind of established himself this aggressive style in the postseason of managing and he didn’t back away from that. He used Fry as a pinch hitter in what the fifth inning or when they had the bases loaded, I think the fourth inning and he’s got one out the base is loaded against Garrett Cole. He said that was the pivotal point of the game. So he pitch hits fry, he pops up on the first pitch and then like you said before, hedges, God love Austin Hedges. He has to come into the game and finish the game out of catching. And we know he’s offensively challenged, obviously Vote knew that too, but he said that was the one point where you got to take your shot and I don’t know if that’s the right way to manage Joe or it’s just being overly aggressive.
Joe Noga (07:30): We heard AJ Hinch in the first round of the playout in the division series say he’s noticed lately, managerial styles in the postseason. Everything is overly aggressive and getting more and more aggressive. Stephen V seems to have taken that, not that message from him, but that I’m in. But it sort of embodies that message thus far. And when it works, it’s great. When it works, it’s guards ball and you’re rolling and everybody in the stadium is like, man, this is how we should play and it’s beautiful and that kind of stuff, but when it doesn’t, you’re relying on maybe a three run home run somewhere along the line to keep you in a game and keep you in a situation and you look up and down this lineup and there’s one maybe two guys in that lineup that can produce that for you. And so far they haven’t. Jose Ramirez really hasn’t been Jose Ramirez to this point in really the whole postseason.
Paul Hoynes (08:29): Yeah, he had one home run against Detroit. He had some good at bats last night in game two against Cole. He hit three straight balls, hard to right field. They kind of died at the track. The last one died at the track, then he finally hit another home run in the ninth inning. But yeah, he’s really swinging hard to me, Joe. He’s up there trying to do too much. Maybe I’d like the at bat he had in game five of the A LDS against Detroit where he kind of bounced one through the right side of the infield that looked more like the Ramirez. We know not a guy that’s swinging from his ankles,
Joe Noga (09:08): Hoynsie, don’t worry, they’re coming back to progressive field. The wind tunnel will take care of Jose Ramirez. All he is got to do is get the ball up in the air to right field and the progressive field Wind tunnel will take care of itself. No, but you worry about that when Aaron Judge hits the majority of his home runs to right center, how that’s going to play in difficult conditions. It’s not going to be pleasant weather to play here in games three through five. But the guardians know what they have to do now and they’re giving the ball to Matt Boyd for game three, just like they did in game five when their backs were against the wall and they had to win that game. Matt Boyd is going to go out there. I would expect maybe they’re going to try to get him to go a little deeper than he did in game five, but it’s more about the matchups and the number of times he faces each batter in the lineup. If he’s able to be efficient and get three innings out of one time through the lineup instead of one inning, one and a half innings. If you start to face multiple batteries, if you see GL Torres up there for the third time by the third inning, that’s not a great combination. And especially for this bullpen that’s been overtaxed so far.
Paul Hoynes (10:32): And Joe, I wonder if there’s ever been two postseason series where starting rotation has meant so little to the final outcome of these series. The final, they’ve, they’ve only had three starting pitchers make these what? Seven starts of Tanner, Bobby Boyd and Alex Cobb and Cobb. None of ‘em have gone more than four and two third innings, which means none of ‘em have gotten a win.
Joe Noga (11:02): They don’t even have a chance to get a win.
Paul Hoynes (11:03): Yeah, I mean is this the way we’re going to see Postseason baseball from now on or is it just that Cleveland is kind of a victim of its own circumstance with the injuries and the stuff that happened to Shane Bieber to his injury? Or is this the way they’re just going to manage his team?
Joe Noga (11:23): If Shane Bieber were here, Shane Bieber would be going as deep into a game as Shane Bieber can because that’s the most effective way to get a win. We’ve seen that. We’ve seen it in the playoffs. The fact is they don’t have Shane Bieber and as much as you would like Tanner Bobby to be Shane Bieber, you can’t just say that he’s Shane Bieber and he is, he’s still young. He’s still learning and he’s still pitching in his first postseason, so you’re not going to get that. Yes. It’s so funny. You manage regular season with your starting rotation and you think about it one way and then you get to the postseason and everything changes. I think Tito ruined us all back in 2016 when he started going to Andrew Miller in the fourth inning when he thought the most critical outs of a game were taking place. But yeah, it’s a change in how traditionally you have done it. You can’t sit here and say it’s right or wrong because every team seems to be doing it a little bit differently. And the one that figures out the formula the right way first is going to get to the championship.
Paul Hoynes (12:32): And you would just like to have one guy you could count on, one guy that could one or two.
Joe Noga (12:37): Yeah, that’d be great.
Paul Hoynes (12:38): Especially in a postseason, a guy that gives you six innings, five and a third, six to seven innings, and they don’t have that. And that’s really, like you were saying before, let’s put a tremendous strain on this bullpen Joe. I mean, Cade Smith has had a great year, probably has to be under consideration for Rookie of the year. He probably won’t get much, but he’s not Superman. He can’t pitch in every game.
Joe Noga (13:03): Well, and you would like his arm to be still hanging off the right side of his body by the time spring training rolls around and you get to do this again. You think back to 2016, they only had two and a third pitchers in a rotation in 2016. So it’s the same way every time Cleveland makes a deep playoff run. Is that going to be the case that they have to do it without three big guns in the rotation? I think that might be a circumstance of this market, knowing that they don’t go out and pay for top line free agent pitchers. They grow pitchers from within and promote them whether they’re ready to or not. And that’s what we’re seeing right now. We’re seeing a young Tanner Bobby, we’re seeing a Matthew Boyd coming off of injury and Alex Cobb coming off of injury. Those are the kind of guys that this franchise can bring in and stick into a starting rotation. So yeah, it’s not ideal, but so far they’ve made it to game three of the A LCS this way. We’re going to find out how much farther they can go as far as the lineup and getting production out of the lineup. You mentioned Brian Rocchio. He’s had a hell of a postseason run so far. He is had hits in every game. We saw him with the night being able to get the ball out of the ballpark. Just how nice has it been to see Rocchi, sort of the switch get flipped for him.
Paul Hoynes (14:31): Yeah, that’s really been great to see. I think we’re starting to see this what exactly the guardians have been talking about over the last four or five years that just the potential of this guy we saw two years ago at AAA Columbus where he put up a lot of big numbers, home runs, triples, doubles. We saw what kind of player he can be. I think it took him a while his first year just to get settled down defensively. I think that was the main concern, especially for a young shortstop. And now we’re starting to see that offensive side of his game. Catch up to that.
Joe Noga (15:12): Don’t kid yourself. It’s the blonde hair. He ds his hair blonde for the playoffs and nobody else on the team has done it. But he goes out there and he’s hitting the ball over the ballpark. Maybe
Paul Hoynes (15:21): They should all do it now.
Joe Noga (15:22): Well, don’t be surprised if we walk into the clubhouse tomorrow and there’s empty boxes of Clare all over the floor. It would not surprise me one bit. Rocchio is hitting Steven Kwan has continued to hit. He’s been consistent and steady and earning all sorts of praise at the top of the lineup. Josh Nailer has a couple of hits. The at bats haven’t looked necessarily great, but he just seems to be stopping at first base every time he gets on. What more does Josh Naer need to do?
Paul Hoynes (15:57): Yeah, Josh has not been driving the ball. I mean, he had a couple of hits against Cole last night in game two, which was a good sign. He looked more relaxed. The swing was nice and relaxed, but he’s got to drive the ball and Ramirez has to drive the ball. Those are the guys. We’ve seen the big guys for the Yankees come through. Now Cleveland’s guys have to answer.
Joe Noga (16:25): Lane Thomas, who was really the darling of the division series, hit the biggest home runs against Detroit. He’s sort of been a non-factor in the first two games of this championship series. It would be nice if there were a threat maybe behind Jose to get him to see some pitches over the play.
Paul Hoynes (16:48): Yeah, well he had an infield hit yesterday in game two and we’ve seen that. He’s kind of a streaky hitter. We’ve seen him. We’ve seen him good, really, really good. And we’ve seen him really, really bad. It’s two games into this thing. I thought he had a good series against Detroit in the A LDS. I think he’s going to be okay.
Joe Noga (17:14): The Yankees bullpen has been lights out in the first two games of the series, Cleveland’s bullpen. It’s ridiculous to expect them to be scoreless every time out to not allow the one-off 490 foot home run for John Carlos Stanton or Aaron Judge, the ball that he hit. I still don’t understand how he hit that fast ball from Hunter Gaddis that was six inches above the strike zone. It’s not reasonable to expect perfection from this bullpen, especially at this point in the season, especially as much as they’ve been used. But is that the only way that the guardians are going to win?
Paul Hoynes (17:59): I think so, yeah. I mean, we know the starting pitching situation isn’t going to change. It’s going to stay the same. They’re Boyd is going to go out there tomorrow and who knows with Vote, he pulled them after two innings the last time and he had five strikeouts, two scoreless innings and he pulled them. So if vote gets the fever, if he thinks the game is hinging in the third inning and he’s got to go with the bullpen, he’s going to do it. So the bullpen, so much pressures on that bullpen and depending on how far the guardians progress in this A LCS, it’s going to be on the shoulders of the pen.
Joe Noga (18:41): I mean, if you’re Kate Smith, you know that you’re the guy getting the first call. You know that you’re going to come in in the third, fourth, fifth inning somewhere in there and you’re going to be asked to get out of a situation with runners on base at the end of an inning and then give them one more clean inning. After that, you might face five, six batters and then your day is done. I can’t see how, plus Kate Smith doesn’t look like he is affected by pressure at all is the most stone-faced guy in that roster. But it’s almost like it’s easier for Kate Smith coming in when he does. It’s the other guys now who have to bridge to Gaddis and Klos a who we haven’t even seen in this series yet. They have to figure out a way to get Emmanuel Class A on the field at some point tomorrow. I would bet my house that at some point in game three, Emmanuel Klos A takes the ball
Paul Hoynes (19:36): Regardless of the score. He’s in there, they’ve got to pitch him. That’s been the how vote has used him regardless all season if it’s safe situation or non-safe situation.
Joe Noga (19:48): So that’s something to look for and something to keep an eye on in game three. And what do you think about the atmosphere? Jason Kipnis, Travis Hafner and Ryan Merritt announced as the first pitch.
Paul Hoynes (20:01): Oh right. Ryan Merrit
Joe Noga (20:02): Really well. They got to get the game five first in order to get the cowboy boots out there, so love it. We’ll see. But Chippy Kippe will be here. That should be a lot of fun to get his take on this team and just to see him out there rolling. Yeah, it needs to be the atmosphere that we saw in game five, that electricity around this ballpark. Because if it’s not, then the season is going to be over before they head back to New York.
Paul Hoynes (20:31): It is going to be rocking. Cleveland loves postseason baseball. They hate the Yankees. So this is the perfect element right
Joe Noga (20:41): Here. Do they hate the Yankees more than they love postseason baseball? It
Paul Hoynes (20:45): Might be. I would think That’s a good question. That’s a coin for,
Joe Noga (20:49): Boy. We got to put that out to the subtext subscribers joint subtext right now and go on and tell us if Cleveland loves the postseason baseball more than they hate the Yankees or not. It’s 3 9 9 a month. To subscribe, go to cleveland.com/subtext to join there. Hoy and I have been pumping out some content to our subscribers throughout this postseason and we’ll continue to do so. Alright, Hoey game three tomorrow, let’s get ready and we will check back in with you then.
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